Why I Left Creatures Caves
As most members of the Creatures community know, I used to be a moderator and active member of Creatures Caves. I disappeared on a couple of occasions, before leaving the site entirely this past April. I’m not the only one: Kezune of Designer Genes posted about her blog’s retirement to the dismay of many. It’s come to my attention that there is now a discussion and poll designed to get opinions about the current moderation team. Not to be negative, but the results of the poll are statistically irrelevant: Users must be signed in to vote, and I’m sure I’m not the only one who doesn’t feel comfortable logging into Creatures Caves just to cast a vote. It seems like some are curious as to why some members have left Creatures Caves rather abruptly. I’m all about transparency, so I’ll gladly share my experiences.
I lost my moderator role when I left the site temporarily, after a fellow staff member started ignoring me and shutting down every idea I had. It was awkward and stressful. No attempt was made to contact me outside of Creatures Caves, so I learned of my lost role when I logged in again. That wasn’t much of a problem for me: It was my fault for not scheduling a leave of absence, although I wasn’t quite sure how to bring up this issue to anyone else. I thought that I might have been overreacting, and I was happy just to be a member of Creatures Caves again. Not being a moderator anymore actually gave me a little space away from this staff member, so all seemed to be alright.
Later on, I made the personal choice to limit my time on Creatures Caves because a lot of activity was unrelated to Creatures. Let me be very clear in saying that I don’t mean to criticize the site for allowing members to talk about other subjects. After all, Creatures isn’t our entire lives! There were a lot of individuals who had negative life experiences going on, and I knew I wasn’t equipped to offer advice. So I took another break to focus on other Creatures subjects, mainly in the form of new Discover Albia posts! I simply wanted to keep things positive in relation to Creatures. This was my own choice, though. My only other concern was how individual content was slowly being centralized on the site. I understand its philosophy of being the hub of Creatures activity, yet it seemed like everyone was being encouraged to post everything to Creatures Caves, and not their own sites or blogs.
Soon enough, I started noticing help topics that went unanswered, even though I had some possible answers. I decided to get active on Creatures Caves again, but only gave my attention to the Creatures-related content. So I started answering questions, interacting with people I hadn’t talked with in awhile, and it was wonderful! I found a good balance. All until it went sour in this resource article. My comment was deleted, without explanation. I was simply trying to point out that a certain individual’s policy was being interpreted incorrectly. I was agreeing with a point made by someone else, and Kezune (a moderator at the time) was having an open discussion about it. Suddenly, the moderator who wrote the resource spoke of me in the third-person and stated that only the site staff could decide on changes to be made. I still don’t think this person even understands what I was trying to say. There was no attempt to cover up anything… An important element of the policy had been left out and misinterpreted. It wasn’t that I was asking that things change simply because I disagreed: I was pointing out an inaccuracy, and trying to help out.
It got worse, though. I was stunned, and responded stating that I would be leaving Creatures Caves for good. The current comment says, “Okay.” This was edited, with no proof of the edit, because this originally said, “Okay. So long then.” A staff member came in to say that this was not the right place for this discussion, and it should be taken to the private messaging system. After being treated this way publicly, I felt even more uncomfortable hearing what this moderator had to say to me privately. Kezune was kind enough to try to continue the conversation, but it was too late. I blame myself a bit for her leaving the community, because a lot of the problems started with what happened to me. This moderator was fine with chasing someone off of the site, without even a second thought. Editing that original comment was, and still is, very questionable.
Was I wrong? I’m sure I made mistakes along the way at Creatures Caves, both as a moderator and a normal member. I apologize for my part in any confusion. I don’t begrudge the individuals, but I will never feel comfortable on the site. There is also this odd assumption that those who speak out about the Creatures Caves staff somehow insinuate that they’re “evil” or not doing good things. This is a case of accountability, and what it is to be a moderator. Deleting and editing comments based on personal motivations is a problem, and I still wonder how a moderator could retain these responsibilities after what happened. It’s not just the fact that it happened: It’s the fact that the moderator never apologized, nor saw the mistake in this. I only hope that this hasn’t happened to anyone else. Note that the majority of the current moderators and staff have never given me cause to question them: This involves a couple of individuals, yet it seems like I’m not alone with this sort of experience.
I do check Creatures Caves from time to time, although I haven’t logged in since April. My decision to leave was based on my own personal experiences, and I hope that everyone understands that this was my choice to make. In many ways, Creatures Caves is a wonderful place for Creatures players to get together and talk about the games. I do miss talking with a lot of the people who can’t be reached anywhere else, yet I want to keep my experiences with Creatures as positive as possible. I was only a member of Creatures Caves for a few years, but my love of Creatures reaches back more than a decade. In the end, I hope that everyone has a positive experience in the community, whether it be on Creatures Caves or elsewhere! The most important thing is to have fun with Creatures. Keep your love of the games alive and healthy!
Images Credited to Gameware Europe
Comments are open, but please keep in mind that this is my personal story. I admit that I may not have done everything right in these situations, yet I’m happy with where I am. If that means that I’ll never be a member of Creatures Caves again, then so be it. This doesn’t mean that I have anything against those who are active members of the site, though. Please continue to enjoy Creatures Caves now and in the future!
I really feel you on this one. The atmosphere over there is changing a bit and it’s starting to get really tense for something thats meant to be fun and collaborative.
I’m sorry to see you go, Jessica, you were always a beacon of positivity in the forums and it’s a real shame that you faced that kind of drama.
Thank you, Molly! I’m sad to hear that the atmosphere is changing, since it used to be such a fun place to hang out. I’m sure it still is for many members, but it’s a shame that I’m not the only one who doesn’t feel as comfortable at Creatures Caves as before. I still try my best to be active in other ways, though, and I’m always available to answer questions over here!
Jessica, thank you so much for sharing your side of the story. I honestly always used to go to Creatures Caves since I got into the Creatures series a year and a half ago after like, 15 years? And I enjoyed reading you and Kezune’s posts a lot. You were always so helpful and friendly. A very positive and energetic presence!
I abruptly noticed last year you weren’t a moderator anymore and didn’t think much of it… but I kinda wondered if something was wrong. Same thing followed with Kezune. So … I started reading blogs, like Amai’s and Kezune’s more. I love the dedication you put into your posts. I don’t know if I could come up with the wonderful slice-of-norn-life(is that a thing…? It is now!) Stories and way you view the happenings in your world. But with all the drama and arguments about politics and stuff, sometimes it just is calming reading about Norn tales. And inspiring me to not just teach the norn all the words and wonder why they behave so badly, which I must’ve been doing for 20 years! I’ve learned a lot and I can’t wait to spend more time with norns individually now, rather than massive wolfing runs…
Wow, do I ever ramble. Anyways… back on point…
I do have an account at Creatures Caves… I just haven’t posted yet ’cause I feel I shouldn’t ’till I ready one of my norn sprites and bug proof XD s’more.) The site has majorly helped me out in my sprite and norn making adventures. It certainly feels like “THE” hub of the creatures community currently, so newbies and returnees will probably find that place and flock to it… I generally think it’s pretty darn great. The vast majority there are wonderful and I feel I shouldn’t post until I can contribute something back as in cob / agent… since I know I downloaded tons from the place!
That said… I’m glad someone with a presence in the community came forward with what happened. It’s always troublesome when people disappear for unknown reasons and you can tell there’s tension going on behind the scenes, but it’s not to be discussed and it’s swept under the rug. Especially when it’s generally so friendly… Transparency in communities is always something I really love :)
So uh, thanks for giving some insight into it. Honestly, sounds like you handled it much better than I would. I like hearing a rundown. It was brave of you to post this, honestly. Keep that chin up and doin’ what you’re doin’!
I appreciate all of the kind words! I think I take the cake for rambling at times, though. Ha! I agree with you about how Creatures Caves is the main area where new and old players will flock to, since it does have a whole lot of information and activity. And you’re completely right about the vast majority being wonderful people who help one another and enjoy talking about Creatures together. We’re a one-of-a-kind community!
As I mentioned, I do miss talking with people on a regular basis, but I’ve got lots to do over here! I really enjoy working on my projects now, and getting all the feedback. There are also a lot of people who have sent me very positive messages lately, sharing their appreciation for what I’ve done. All I want is to make sure that players enjoy Creatures, which seems to be happening! Without any stressful stuff to worry about, I feel like I can enjoy the game and the community much more than when I was a part of Creatures Caves. Hopefully things will improve, though, so everyone can feel welcome there!
Thanks for being brave and coming forward with your story, Jessica! The way you were treated was downright appalling.
You’re welcome! Kezune really brought things into the open, and I didn’t want it to seem like she was the only one who had a bad experience. These were isolated incidents, yet nothing has been done, and it seems like a couple of individuals are still creating negative experiences for Creatures Caves members. It saddens me to think that people are having part of the community ruined for them. Although I may not agree with everything that’s on Creatures Caves, I will say that it’s a great place to find downloads, learn more, and talk with other Creatures players. I hope that steps will be taken to avoid something similar to what happened to me, though.
It’s not a problem for me, though! I’ve dealt with it, and moved onto more positive things. Although I don’t know if a population of frustrating Norns or a broken bit of CAOS scripting can be a positive experience for too long… Ha ha!
It’s great to see you continuing activity out of Creatures Caves. It has long made me feel a bit limited in that Creatures Caves has almost become “THE Creatures website” which was why I created computer pets, and left Tumblr because I got involved in social justice warrior garbage that I shouldn’t have touched with a 10 foot pole.
Sorry let me clarify unless you don’t know.
Computer Pets was my Creatures and Petz blog on Tumblr, but I got dragged down with people on Tumblr and felt I had to leave. I should make a new blog.
Merged your comments and toned down one word a little bit. It’s no problem: Just wanted to let you know!
Sorry to hear about your bad experiences on Tumblr. I haven’t played Petz in ages, although I loved it way back in the day! Blogging seems to be a pretty safe and open way to write about Creatures and other games. There are a few free services, and it’s also nice to be able to write about what you want to. Luckily, I’ve had almost entirely good experiences with the comments I receive. Even those who disagree or criticize do so in a respectful manner, usually resulting in me laughing at some silly mistake of mine! If you’d like any help getting back into blogging about Creatures, feel free to get in touch with me: I’m always happy to see more people writing about how they enjoy the games!
Apologies for bad language :B I’ll consider that in future.
Oh, no worries! That’s part of my job over here, as I try my best to keep things safe for a younger crowd. I’m just remembering how young I was when I got into Creatures, and one never knows who’s out there reading about this stuff! Again, though, no need to apologize, but I do appreciate you taking it into account in the future!
I have always wandered in and out of the C.Community, so I was gone when all this hit the fan. I’m so sorry that all that happened to you and Kezune! I knew something had happened, but had no idea what it was. There is a bit of unspoken tension in the site now that I don’t remember being there in the past. On a much happier note… I love your blog and have read all your posts. Please keep up the great work!
Thank you! It really is a shame about what happened, but I hope that everyone involved can move on and just enjoy Creatures. I’ve been busy lately, yet I’m hoping to get back into more regular updates soon! It means a lot to know that there’s someone else who enjoys reading what I write. Hope you continue to stop by!
I wasn’t very active on CC for a few months, but I did notice recently that you disappeared, an was wondering where you went… Then there was a couple of weeks ago some more drama with some other members, that spilled over into the bibble comments which is when I figured out something was wrong… I think that drama was still ultimately about the original thing with you and Kezune though… It’s sad to see something like this lose great contributors to the Caves like you two.
I’m just glad that you are at least still involved with Creatures… You’re the one that helped rekindle my interest in the games with your blog… I didn’t even know anyone still knew what they were so long after they came out, or that anyone was actually interested in something that brought me so much pure nerdish glee… and your site not only hooked me again, but led me to the Caves, a whole community which I didn’t even know existed… I have to thank you for that, and I want you to know you will be missed there.
Thank you for saying all of that! It does sadden me that part of the community didn’t work out for me, but I do hope that the drama has ended for everyone else. I haven’t been contributing much lately, courtesy of a busy work schedule, but I’ll be back to enjoying all of the nerdy science and genetics soon enough! The biggest reward I get is being able to get others interested in Creatures, either for the first time, or in new ways. Whatever happens in the community, I only hope that each individual will enjoy the games in some way!
Yours is more or less the only Creatures-related online thing I still check occasionally, so I appreciate your hard work, and I’m sorry to hear things have been negative on CC.com. I added a comment to the resource doc in question clarifying my own position on redistribution and alteration, thank you for bringing it up (even if the context was a bit awful). Hope you are going well otherwise. x
Thanks, Liam! Things are very busy for me lately, giving me little time for Creatures, but that should get better partway through September. I’ve been having a lot of fun learning CAOS and fixing up some C1 items! I can’t wait to get back into those projects, and also have some more fun with Creatures! Hope all is going well for you, too!
Hi, Jessica. Well, actually, hello again.
I started playing Creatures, the year it came out. I played a little, when I could, but never really ‘got’ it. 15 years later I discovered CC and they pointed me to your Youtube channel. Bam- love Creatures, love you too!
You’d recently left CC at the time that I discovered you, so we never really got to meet/greet/get to know each other.
I just wanted to share that I had felt some hostility from the CC community off and on, and I found it tended to be snappy and ‘out of the blue’ when stuff I would say would get taken out of context. I left permanently after one chat session we were talking about (human) respiratory health and issues, and I made a comment about running being an amazing tool for increasing lung capacity albeit hard on the knees…. and I got wrecked for being a cruel and insensitive person. Apparently the member we’d been talking to was in a wheelchair. I tried to reason that I had no idea about that, and just presumed that she was on the same playing field as most of us… that my comment showed that I was treating her as an equal – nope. Callous and cruel I am.
I mean sure, I only spent the first 15 years of my life looking after my uncle who lived with us, he had MS and was wheelchair bound. He passed, and my grandparents, who raised me, passed the year after – therefore I was off to work on a dairy farm as a 16yo. I’m only sharing that to show that I am empathetic toward those who struggle with health… but it annoyed and frustrated me so much that I couldn’t get that across. That I was a bad guy for not treating this person any different. (even though I didn’t know there was anything different). I don’t even think that it was the person in question who ‘attacked’ me.
Anyway. I stuck my head in CC the other day, and there are about 15 lurkers, and only 2 people who have actually spoken, at all, in CC chat over the last week. So, it’s not so active these days, or at least it doesn’t appear so. But I will say that those who have been on have been ultra helpful.
Thank you for the kind words! It’s great to hear that you’ve gotten back into Creatures after all this time. I know what you mean about not getting it right away, though. I don’t even know what I was doing when I was a kid, but I do remember the games fondly. Guess that’s all one can ask for, right? Ha!
Sorry to hear about your bad experiences. I would say it’s a shame that these things happen to more and more people, but I’ll go out on a limb and say what it really is: Wrong. The Creatures community is small enough, and making people feel bad to the point that they leave is not just harmful to Creatures, but also to those people. I don’t understand the motivations behind some members of Creatures Caves. Players are still welcome to go there, yet I could issue a word of caution.
Seems that it’s quiet, yet I’m happy to hear that you had a nice experience returning there. Good luck! I’m hoping to get active again here at Discover Albia, so perhaps you’ll have some more Creatures-related stuff to look forward to. Thanks for stopping by and commenting! All the best to you!